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So I saw Return of the Jedi again recently...
Jace_VaritekDate: Sunday, 12 Sep 2010, 9:20 PM | Message # 1
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... and is it just me, or doesn't it seem like there'd really be nothing wrong with Luke killing the Emperor in the final confrontation? I mean, I would kill him. I would have decided on that long, awkward elevator ride up to the throne room that if I got a chance to kill the Emperor, I'd do it. Not out of anger or anything, just because the fact that he's the enemy leader during a time of war. I mean, I wouldn't feel bad about killing Hitler during World War 2 either. And it wouldn't even be against the law or anything. It's not like you could capture Palpatine if you tried. Your only real choice is to kill him. Or let him live, so that, what, you can feel good about yourself? I'm sure the galaxy would be really happy to know that Luke died feeling good about himself when he could have killed Palpatine, the destroyer of worlds. And he would have died, too, if Vader hadn't stopped Palpatine. And if he hadn't stopped Palpatine, what kind of crappy moral of the story would that have been? And bear in mind, that is the moral of the story, because whether Vader had a conscience or didn't isn't really relevant to the decision that Luke makes.

So what is the moral? That it's wrong to do things out of anger? Well it isn't really, now is it? Sometimes it's good to be angry. Anger gets results (witness Obi-Wan after Qui-Gon's death, who kills Darth Maul in a fit of rage and doesn't regret it for a second. You don't see Obi-Wan turning "evil," and the audience isn't led to believe that he did anything wrong, either, because obviously he didn't. But this situation is no different from Luke and the Emperor, except that Palpatine killed billions while Darth Maul killed only one person).

In the hopes of trying to find some of George's intended meaning here, I look to the fight between Dooku and Anakin in the beginning of Revenge of the Sith, which is clearly intended as an homage to the throne room confrontation in Return of the Jedi. But in these two, similar scenes, the motives of Luke, Vader and Palpatine in Return of the Jedi are deep, while the motives of Anakin, Dooku, and Palpatine in Revenge of the Sith are so shallow that you can't sink a toe into them. In this scene, in Revenge of the Sith, we see a very one dimensional fight between characters who the audience doesn't really care about (complete with lame dialogue which, sadly, occurs throughout the film. One word: "Noooooooooooooooo!!"). When Anakin kills Dooku, Palpatine makes an argument so absurd—"He cut off your arm, you wanted revenge. It's only natural"—that not even Anakin, who has the emotional IQ of a two-year-old, should be persuaded that it makes it okay to murder someone.

In the end, despite evoking themes similar to the confrontation scene in Return of the Jedi, this scene in Revenge of the Sith turns out to be completely inconsequential. Not only inconsquential, in fact, but it actually contradicts later events. Palpatine tells Anakin that Dooku is too dangerous to live and must be killed, and Anakin apparently finds this persuasive enough to murder an unarmed old man. Unarmed, haha. Get it? Okay, but later on Mace Windu tells Anakin exactly the same thing about Palpatine, and he has the more compelling case to make that Palpatine controls the Senate and the courts and that he probably is too dangerous to live. But for some reason, here Anakin finds the murder of an unarmed old man unacceptable. La la la. Well, we do know the reason, I suppose—Palpatine, a known manipulator, made some bullshit promise about saving Padme from uncertain death! Because Anakin saw her death in a dream, you see, and, you know, dreams tend to come true.

But back to Dooku. It's unfortunate that they only had Christopher Lee for one day of filming, and thus had to kill him off at the beginning of the movie. It's unfortunate for us, that is, because we are deprived of Christopher Lee and have to suffer through the embarassing CGI character of General Grievous as a result. But perhaps it was fortunate for Lee, a stately actor whose career has escaped the odor of this film (although he didn't escape this embarassment. Sorry Rage). Tragically, the same cannot be said for Natalie Portman, who I love but whose performance in Revenge of the Sith makes me hate myself for doing so. But alas, this is not the time for my rant about Natalie Portman going from a positive role model in Episode II (a determined, pragmatic career woman who is passionate about politics and isn't afraid to pop a cap) to a common, chauvinist stereotype in Episode III of a woman who loses all of her independence when she becomes pregnant (she spends the film fretting, utterly helpless, nervously trying on dresses and braiding her hair while the Jedi Temple burns and while her fellow Senator, Bail Organa, is suddenly as assertive as she should be! At the end of the film, all she wants to do, in her words, is "run away"). Well, looks like I ranted about it anyway.

Then again, Natalie Portman never said she was a role model.

But I digress. I could go on and on about how the prequels are empty of meaning, but it's Return of the Jedi where I'm looking for meaning, here. This assumes that, unlike the prequels, there is some meaning to be found in it. So could it be that I'm missing the point of the confrontation scene in the throne room? Or could it be that, as I watched the film as a child, I never really considered what that meaning was, and now that I have considered it, I find that it really is a crappy meaning? Or could it be that I'm spending way too much time thinking about this when I could be posting? What do you think?


Jace Varitek
Manager/Administrator from January 2003 to Present
My recent posts here, pre-2009 archives here

"When my information changes, I change my opinion. What do you do, sir?"
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Furthermore, a dancing Wookiee:
 
Boba_FettDate: Tuesday, 14 Sep 2010, 7:49 AM | Message # 2
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I did write a reply to this, but being a bit drunk it sounded pretentious and I decided to delete it tongue

"I bow to no one and I give service only for cause".

Message edited by Boba_Fett - Tuesday, 14 Sep 2010, 8:01 AM
 
Tyra_VosanaDate: Tuesday, 14 Sep 2010, 4:13 PM | Message # 3
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I will have to agree with you on that but what they don't ever do in the movies (that I have noticed anyway) is use common sense in some circumstances. to be angry is to be human. to have emotion over anything anger or otherwise however is to be alive. this is an ideal that never seems to be taught within the jedi order instead they put everything in a black and white sense. anger leads to darkness etc. when that is not necessarally true. the force itself does not call on one particular power to do anything it is a whole ,not split into sections and divisions. the allignment depends on the person. but that doesn't mean that experiencing anger is a bad thing. for it is far better to let what you are feeling out then to hold everything in and end up slaughtering everything in sight simply because its there. Vader was confused. but the reasons that made him a sith (in the star wars sense of what sith later became) have nothing to do with what a sith truly is. which is unfortunate that he was not trained in the ways of the old order so to speak. his ideals alone as to why he turned would have weakened him. then again, had the jedi order been more flexible within their teachings, a lot of them wouldn't have fallen in the first place. Dooku in his own right was what a sith should have been even though he did not have the years of training within that order. his patience is something Vader should have had but lacked terribly. while he was a guardian and combat was not an issue he wasn't as "it is either my way or else" disposition that Vader had. (grevious and gunray wouldn't hve lived long had he had that disposition) ((oh and Jace, thanks for linking the video I have been looking for that one))

 
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