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The Clone Retirement Act
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Wednesday, 27 Jun 2012, 6:02 PM | Message # 1 |
 Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| The Clone Retirement Act
Purpose-
- As per the Chair of the Senate, this act is created to assist the clones who served faithfully in the Clone Wars into retirement so as to be able to preserve the fighting integrity of the Imperial Armed Forces.
Article I-
- Recognizing that clone forces were biologically aged so as to serve the former Republic and now the Galactic Empire, the Senate offers high commendation to all clones who served loyally and faithfully through the long years from the Clone Wars to the present.
Article II-
- Understanding that the process in which the clones were aged led to rapid biological deterioration, the Senate places a biological age restriction of sixty standard years upon clones presently serving in the Imperial Armed Forces.
Article III-
- All clones presently holding a significant rank that are currently between the biological ages of fifty and sixty may continue to hold that rank until they reach the biological age of sixty. This will allow clones who are veterans of combat to pass on their knowledge to the best of their ability to new commanding officers so that the Imperial Armed Forces may retain its integrity in combat situations with a maximum of efficiency.
Article IV-
- Clones having reached a biological age of sixty or greater will be retired from the armed services, excepting units specified by the Empire to be exempt from this ruling.
Article V-
- Clones with a biological age of sixty or greater will have the personal option to select euthanasia. Those that select this option will be posthumously granted high accolades, full military burials and ceremonies for their selfless service and willingness to continue to serve the Galactic Empire by preventing any budget strain upon the Galactic Empire and adopting a death with dignity option.
Article VI-
- Clones choosing not to enter into a euthanasia agreement will be retired from military service and placed into jobs that allow them to assist the general populace in a manner the Empire sees fit. Clones not wishing to continue service will be allowed to live out the remainder of their lives on the Imperial-aligned planet of their choice with a modest pension which will be decided by the Senate. This pension will not carry over to the families of any clones should they chose to marry at this stage.
Article VII-
- All retired clones have their serial numbers and biometric ID information entered into inter-planetary criminal databases.
Explanation of Terms-
- Significant rank refers to the following-
- Commander to Line Captain (Imperial Naval Forces)
- Colonel to High General (Imperial Army)
- Senior Commander to Senior General (Stormtrooper Corps)
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
Message edited by Alyn_Stark - Friday, 29 Jun 2012, 5:17 AM |
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| Draken_Turot | Date: Wednesday, 27 Jun 2012, 6:06 PM | Message # 2 |
 Major general
Group: Users
Messages: 258
Status: Offline
| I think!...
That any of His Majesty's Stormtroopers responsible for the death of those disgusting Jedi scum should be held to a higher honor as they were responsible for stopping the Jedi Coup!!!
Message edited by Xane_Ray - Wednesday, 27 Jun 2012, 6:07 PM |
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Wednesday, 27 Jun 2012, 6:18 PM | Message # 3 |
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Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| I agree fully, Governor-General. However, there is a limit to the height of awards that can be granted by the Imperial Armed Forces for military service. I believe that any clones who were directly responsible for the pacification of the Jedi will be more than happy to receive the awards and accolades given to them either at present or in the future for their actions. All people of the Empire know of their loyalty and bravery, after all.
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
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| Ilanah_Thanatos | Date: Thursday, 28 Jun 2012, 8:04 AM | Message # 4 |
 Colonel general
Group: Users
Messages: 891
Status: Offline
| Mr. Stark, I was reminded by my assistant when I read your proposal that Eli Fitzgerald started a discussion about this same issue about a year or so ago. When you wrote this piece of legislation, did you keep that discussion in mind? You mention, several times, about the rapid aging and deterioration of the clones and their option to choose euthanasia or not. I wonder what the plan is for their healthcare should they not choose the euthanasia route.
Aside from that concern, I think your proposal is quite well put and Chandrila will vote in favor.
Ilanah R. Thanatos
Senator of Chandrila
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| Senator_Cambrist | Date: Thursday, 28 Jun 2012, 11:23 AM | Message # 5 |
 Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 761
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| There remain several problems that this bill doesn't address. We can't simply release genetically-identical populations of insanity-prone individuals onto Core Worlds—odd that the Senator of Lorrd specifies the Core Worlds in his bill, as though this is a problem he'd not have on his planet. The fact remains, if there's going to be a "retirement" option—which I don't support—law enforcement and other government agencies need a way to distinguish one clone from another. I propose all "retired" clones have their serial numbers and biometric ID information entered into inter-planetary criminal databases. Not that they're criminals, mind you, but criminal databases are something that planets have access to already; it'd be simpler than starting some costly "clone database" that's only good for the handful of years before these clones expire.
But, to reiterate, I don't support this "retirement" option. Clones were manufactured for a purpose—to fight and die for the Empire. They may be too old to fight, but they're not too old to die; mandatory euthanasia would be the simplest solution. Distasteful, though. But for as long as clones live, they should continue to serve—even if it means phasing them into, for example, firefighting forces on various worlds. Who knows how many thousands could be put to work on Imperial Center alone? Maintaining landing platforms, traffic control, manning the orbital mirrors, and so on. The Empire could even rent them for private security duties.
Article IV, certainly, is problematic. The Empire has specifically said that some clone units, such as the 501st Legion, will continue to exist. I think that's a decision the Empire is entitled to make for itself. Our job, as I understand it, is simply to accommodate the clones who are phased out, not to decide for ourselves which of them will or won't be phased out.
Message edited by Senator_Cambrist - Thursday, 28 Jun 2012, 11:23 AM |
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| Draken_Turot | Date: Thursday, 28 Jun 2012, 1:16 PM | Message # 6 |
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Major general
Group: Users
Messages: 258
Status: Offline
| If I may suggest something!
If location is a problem, there a tons of planets within the Empire's grasp that can certainly survey worlds that can be selected to place these clones on! Give them an empty or small-populated planet (on good terms with the Mighty Empire, of course!) and we land them there, build them a few buildings to live in, and monitor them! This way, any clone that demonstrates other purposes useful can be transported elsewhere!
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Friday, 29 Jun 2012, 5:19 AM | Message # 7 |
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Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| You'll find a number of changes have been made, Senators.
Incidentally, Senator Cambrist, I assume that clones would prefer the Core Worlds, seeing as how hard they fought to defend them from oppression and that the inhabitants of the Core Worlds would be more than pleased to house the defenders of their freedom. Lorrd, of course, always welcomes visitors and permanent would-be residents.
You'll find I have adopted several of your suggestions as well, Senator.
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
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| Eli_Fitzgerald | Date: Tuesday, 07 Aug 2012, 9:57 PM | Message # 8 |
 Major general
Group: Users
Messages: 355
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| I don't think we should be treating these veterans like criminals—or animals, either. I don't like the use of the term "euthanasia." Death with dignity is one thing, and if that's what they choose, that's what they choose. But before I vote for this I want to be sure that death with dignity is an option that's available to these clones, but not one that's encouraged; I'd rather see them honored in life than in death. And what about the right to vote, Senator Stark? I don't see it in this bill, but having fought for the Republic and the Empire, I think it's something these clones deserve.
Eli Fitzgerald
Senator of Ralltiir (10 BBY—Present)
"I was elected to do some flamethrowing in the Senate. To a light a fire under those Senators and make it hot for them."
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Thursday, 09 Aug 2012, 3:18 PM | Message # 9 |
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Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| You bring up a fair point, Senator Fitzgerald. The right to vote is enjoyed by all contributing members of the Empire, after all, but I am curious to hear certain points of view on this matter, largely from the Chairman, the Defense Committee and, oddly perhaps, Governor Oswaldt for his military experience on the matter, at least before I make an amendment on that point.
While euthanasia is not always a pleasant term, that is, in fact, the correct term for death with dignity. It's not a mass execution or any such, but a quiet affair. While it certainly isn't encouraged, I wished to bring the option to the front so that it does exist.
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
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| Johannes_Oswaldt | Date: Saturday, 11 Aug 2012, 1:25 PM | Message # 10 |
 Major general
Group: Users
Messages: 250
Status: Offline
| Clones are materiel. Both a clone and his blaster are weapons, designed and built for war. A clone does what he's told and doesn't have rights. If a clone has an opinion about something, it's an opinion given to him courtesy of Kamino. Flash memory is what it's called. Clones voting? Don't be silly. Clones don't make decisions. There's one solution to this problem, Senators.. Clone is too old to fight? Give him a blaster pistol and leave him alone in a room. He'll know what to do.
We created the clones to do what they did for us. We don't owe them anything.
Johannes Oswaldt
Senator and Governor of Eriadu
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| Senator_Cambrist | Date: Wednesday, 15 Aug 2012, 9:37 AM | Message # 11 |
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Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 761
Status: Offline
| I'm sympathetic to Governor Oswaldt's view. Naturally-occurring life has value, but does biologically-engineered life have value if it was engineered for a purpose, and when that purpose has been served? I'm doubtful. But clones, to be sure, are thinking and feeling beings and we shouldn't be cruel to them. I don't support shooting them, but nor do I support a right to vote either, for the reasons Governor Oswaldt has said. Clones were engineered to be obedient, and the idea of an "obedient voter" is repugnant to democracy.
I won't oppose this bill as long as a right to vote is not included, since Senator Stark has included some of my ideas and I have no more to add.
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Wednesday, 15 Aug 2012, 11:36 AM | Message # 12 |
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Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| Having heard the points made both by Senator Cambrist and Governor Oswaldt and pending any further input from the Chairman, I do not foresee any amendment forthcoming in the voting rights for clones.
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
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| Senator_Ordan | Date: Thursday, 16 Aug 2012, 1:13 PM | Message # 13 |
 Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 633
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| Do they want to retire? If I were a genetically created soldier trained and drilled my whole life for the purpose of serving then I would find myself miserable at the prospect of being retired when I still had strength to keep going.
Senator Hubert Ordan
__________________________
Senator of the Azure Sector
Foreign Minister of Anaxes
Captain-General of the Azure Interest Protection Squadron
Deputy Chairman of the Ethics Committee
Worshipful Master of the Most Loyal and Honourable Company of Blockadeers
Archtreasurer of the Vault of Pols Anaxes
Autocrat of Selgon
Owner of Azure Durasteel
Systems Admiral (Ret)
Order of the Canted Circle
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| Alyn_Stark | Date: Thursday, 16 Aug 2012, 6:16 PM | Message # 14 |
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Generalissimo
Group: Users
Messages: 1359
Status: Offline
| One can only assume that if you were a genetically created and engineered soldier who had been trained and drilled your whole life for the purpose of serving that you'd do as ordered and retire when ordered. That is, after all, what the clones are supposed to do: follow the orders of those set above them.
Alyn Stark
Lord of Kinyov
Senior Captain, Retired, Republic Navy
Head of House Malos (former)
Licensed bounty hunter
Majority shareholder, Lorrd Engineering
Owner, Stark Defense Conglomerate
Civilian Medal of Honor recipient
Representative, Lorrd (10 BBY-9 BBY)
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| Senator_Cambrist | Date: Thursday, 16 Aug 2012, 8:41 PM | Message # 15 |
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Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 761
Status: Offline
| "The strength to keep going" is the operative phrase. My understanding of the dilemma is that most clones today who are chronologically 20 years of age are the biological equivalent of 60 years of age, due to growth acceleration. Many clones who were produced in a hurry, later on during the war, are even older today as a result. I agree with Senator Ordan's assessment, however, and what I know of clones confirms it to be true, that they want to be of service. It's their purpose in life. Hence my suggestion, that they remain of service as firefighters, for instance, or rented as private security. While I'm still not enthusiastic about Senator Stark's proposal, I'm satisfied that it has incorporated these ideas, and the idea of entering these clones into criminal databases for record-keeping purposes. That, and there simply hasn't been a better proposal—Senator Fitzgerald's ideas are absurd, and we're fortunate that Senator Stark hasn't listened to him.
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