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Stats for the New guns
Crin_StarDate: Monday, 03 Jan 2011, 9:53 PM | Message # 1
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Alright essentially since i've covered this with jace in IM just posting it up here for him.

The guns will operate on a similar basis as the Iowa class battleship's main guns.

The projectiles themselves will be protected by a magnetic field and pushed out with an outer temperature range of around 1000 degrees celcius but the inner metal is protected by said magnetic field. After ejection and the rotation forced by the barrels the projectile then engages a rocket boost system which will burn tibanna gas until it either runs out or hits its target. Each one is self propelled and guided by onboard control circuits.

There will be three different types of warheads:

Explosive tipped: meant for the lighter class of starship hull. The light explosive, (no more than what a couple turbo laser blasts would do), is bore into the tip of the projectile who gains its true damage through momentum and weight rather than through a simple explosion.

Armor Piercing: Designed specifically to be able to survive initial contact with a thick powerful hull like a modern APR. no explosives.

Depleted Uranium: DU

Most will have little or no explosive yield and are self guided and do not operate on the properties of a rail gun, because after all they are maintaining and using their own thrust. As such they are more inline with a standard torpedo except a lot more unique and of course useful on specific types of targets.

 
Jace_VaritekDate: Monday, 03 Jan 2011, 11:01 PM | Message # 2
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UNDER REVIEW. In the meantime, though, can you confirm for me that the following statistics for the Avenger are now correct?

Length: 1650 Meters
Maximum Acceleration: 2,400 g
MGLT: 60 MGLT
Engines: 6 Creveld-4 Radial Ion Drives
Hyperdrive Rating: Class 15 (Backup: 15)
Main Reactor: Hypermatter Annihilator
Shielding: Roughly Equivilent to that of a Victory I class Star Destroyer
Hull: Equivilent to that of a Venator class Star Destroyer
Navigation: Equipped Navicomputer

Armament:
6- of the weapons you describe above, 180 degree forward arcing mounted guns, 16 inch barrel diameter. Have to be manually reloaded after each shot. In two groups of three guns.
3- of the same, rear mounted, 180 degrees

10- Medium dual turbolaser cannons
45- point-defense laser cannons
6- Tractor Beam Projectors
6- Heavy Proton Torpedo tubes (16 torpedoes each)

Complement:
24- Alpha 3 Nimbus-class V-wings
36- TIE fighters
50- MMPs
11- MAT-29 Razorbacks
9- MPCs
400 Marines (included in passenger count)
Various Shuttles
Prefabricated Garrison base

Passengers: 2,400 maximum, depending on configuration
Cargo Capacity: 15,000 tons
Consumables: 3 years

It's my understanding that these are the final modifications necessary to be in compliance with all of the new regulations.


Jace Varitek
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My recent posts here, pre-2009 archives here

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Furthermore, a dancing Wookiee:
 
Crin_StarDate: Monday, 03 Jan 2011, 11:06 PM | Message # 3
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Looks about right to me as of right now. Though I suspect consumables may actually be higher without the prefab base and all the other ground vehicles on board..but that just be being insane right now. So Im going with that it looks right.
 
Jace_VaritekDate: Tuesday, 04 Jan 2011, 10:06 PM | Message # 4
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Okay, having spent a lot of time researching these guns, I can now officially say that I've really spent a lot of time researching these guns. More than I would like to, in all honesty. I actually have a point to mentioning this that I'll come to in a moment, but first, what I've been able to discern about the technology involved here from consulting with three different people, who all seem to agree; first, and most importantly, "momentum and weight" doesn't really make any difference against a shielded target in Star Wars, in this particular case. If, say, magnetic acceleration was used to propel these projectiles resulting in tremendous amount of speed (on the order of millions of meters per second), then these projectiles might have a demonstrable effect on the basis of their momentum and weight. But using the basis of the Iowa-class battleship's guns, we're talking about a speed of around 800 meters per second. If we estimate, as the Incredible Cross Sections do, that an average "couple of turbolaser blasts" is about 10 megatons and that these still don't do a lot of damage against shields, nothing close to 10 megatons is going to result from momentum and weight alone, unless both the momentum and the weight are much, much larger than we're talking about here. And, incidentally, much larger than I'd be willing to approve.

Momentum and weight, therefore, should not be said to make too much of a difference here. Unfortunately, this means that the armor-piercing and depleted uranium projectiles are going to be essentially useless against shields (also, while depleted uranium is one of the densest metals we know of, my rule of thumb is that Star Wars technology, generally, is always superior to what we have in the real world and, thus, there are metals far denser than this. We don't know what these Star Wars metals are, and we don't really need to, either).

The explosive-tipped projectile, then, is the only one I can see being used practically against Star Wars shielding, and this is really only because of the explosive tip which, as you say, is about the power of a couple of turbolaser blasts. In other words, it's a big proton torpedo with a lot of thrust to it. As I said, I suspect the thrust doesn't make a lot of difference in terms of the damage it does, but it would, of course, be useful in making it harder to shoot down than an average proton torpedo. There's a potential problem though even with the propulsion; that is to say, the tibanna gas. As a highly flammable and unstable gas that has rather narrow applications (I won't get into them here, this post is complicated enough), I think it would be hard to burn it as fuel for propulsion without simply blowing it all up. But! There is hope for this, too. We know that there are many different methods of propulsion in Star Wars, even if we don't necessarily know what they are. Personally, I'm fine not knowing what it is. As long as you say "it's a self-propelled projectile," that's adequate to me. A lot of Star Wars technology, after all, works solely on the basis of saying "this works," without going into detail.

And so we come full circle. That is, the benefit of Star Wars simply saying "this works"—unlike other films, like 2001, and TV shows like the original Star Trek, which were researched down to every scientific detail—is that it avoids having to do what I've done; research this a lot. You can go into that detail if you want, of course, and sometimes it is necessary, but be advised you generally don't have to and, when you do, you run the risk of having a technology, like this one, that doesn't seem to be applicable to Star Wars based on what we do know of it. Therefore, since certain aspects of this technology apparently need to be modified now anyway, I would suggest modifying them to simply say "they work," without elaborating how more than you have to. Easier for me, easier for you. Duff Beer for me, Duff Beer for you. I'll have a Duff, you'll have one too.


Jace Varitek
Manager/Administrator from January 2003 to Present
My recent posts here, pre-2009 archives here

"When my information changes, I change my opinion. What do you do, sir?"
—John Maynard Keynes

Furthermore, a dancing Wookiee:
 
Crin_StarDate: Tuesday, 04 Jan 2011, 10:14 PM | Message # 5
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Okay makes sense. Id like to keep those two none-the-less as a type of after-the-shields-are-down type of weapons to be used directly against hulls instead of against shielded targets whose shields would have likely been brought down by the turbolasers the ship already possesses and/or the concentrated attacks of fighter bombers and the other auxillary ships which Volus has in its possession. I will change it to the fact it just works but on basic principal that it is ejected at high velocity from the guns with a magnetic field protecting the metal from the extreme heat generated by the firing in the barrels and then go on to use self propulsion to reach their targets.
 
Jace_VaritekDate: Tuesday, 04 Jan 2011, 10:21 PM | Message # 6
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Sounds good, and yes, I forgot to mention they would be good against unshielded targets and brutal against surface targets. With that all sorted out, I vote to APPROVE.

Jace Varitek
Manager/Administrator from January 2003 to Present
My recent posts here, pre-2009 archives here

"When my information changes, I change my opinion. What do you do, sir?"
—John Maynard Keynes

Furthermore, a dancing Wookiee:
 
Jory_CarsonDate: Wednesday, 05 Jan 2011, 8:16 PM | Message # 7
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Not that I do not trust Jace's research or opinion but I need to look into this before I can cast a vote and feel right about ti.

Vote: UNDER REVIEW

 
Karth_DeQoraDate: Thursday, 06 Jan 2011, 0:52 AM | Message # 8
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It's nice to see the Avenger finally getting sorted out, though I suppose that might make my Imperial character a tad unnecessary, I'm willing to let that slide =p.

(MOTION TO APPROVE)


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Jace Varitek: In Northern California we just have gangs of vigilante interior decorators.
 
Jory_CarsonDate: Tuesday, 11 Jan 2011, 2:37 PM | Message # 9
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I generally love to read, but something about requests makes me hate it...

However, after alot of reading (alot...) I have to say that, onec again, I agree wholly with Jace. These weapons would near useless unless reserved for surface targets where velocity can dramatically change things.

So, after saying things that are really pointless I'll just say

Vote: APPROVE

and with the others' agreement this request is

APPROVED
 
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