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Repeal of Section II of the Deralian Chastisement Act
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| Augusta_Aurelius | Date: Sunday, 12 Feb 2012, 10:13 PM | Message # 1 |
 Lieutenant colonel
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| Repeal of Section II of the Deralian Chastisement Act
Written and Proposed by Senator Augusta Aurelius of Deralia and the Tammuz Sector
The Deralian Chastisement Act, written and proposed by Senator Bernard Oriel of Vjun, while passed by this body, contains several issues many of which are damaging to the Empire as a whole, as I said before. It is apparent however that the Senate's feelings are against Deralia going without punishment, and I will agree with the body as a whole, that acting as unilaterally as we did, warranted some form of punishment. Thus, I propose this act to repeal some, but not all, of the Deralian Chastisement Act. Specifically, Section II; which I feel, as does my government, places an unnecessary burden, and needless bureaucracy upon our military. In the Outer Rim, one must be able to react quickly, and adapt quickly. With this provision in place, we will find ourselves constrained, should our defense prove inadequate, with red tape that limits our ability to respond to the ever changing, and constant, threats of life if the Rim.
Deralia accepts its punishment for its actions, but this section just simple goes too far in limiting our sovereignty and self-determination. We understand the concerns of the Senate, and believe me, the anger that was felt. I mean, look, however, at our military, despite our misguided move at Dantooine. It was our world, and a group of concerned citizens from the Auril Sector, which resisted and drove back the Cronese Mandate from Caluula in an act of pure aggression and imperialism, that even the Ruling Council stood against and yet the Cronese acted anyways. Our military is needed in the Rim, and it should not be limited or constrained needlessly.
The following of the Deralian Chastisement Act, is to be repealed, effective immediately, following the passing of this legislation.
Section II
"Deralia is prohibited from purchasing or building any type of warships without complete approval from the Defense Committee."
Augusta Aurelius
Queen Conosrt of Deralia
Chair of the Human Rights Monitoring and Crisis Resolution Sub-Committee of the Planetary Defense Committee
Senator of Deralia and the Tammuz Sector (30 BBY - 18 BBY, 10 BBY - Present)
Message edited by Queen_Deralius_III - Sunday, 12 Feb 2012, 10:20 PM |
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| Bernard_Oriel | Date: Tuesday, 14 Feb 2012, 5:55 AM | Message # 2 |
 Colonel general
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| Gentlemen,
I for one am sick of Deralia and it's friends constantly attempting to repeal these provisions despite the will of the Senate being well expressed now in several defeats of it's repeals. I am from the Rim, and even I am becoming sick of Deralia's constant bellyaching with regard to fair provisions which limit it's ability to become more dangerous.
Deralia has already enlarged it's military by 133% in the last month (also attempting to subvert the new Defense Committee by making an "eleventh hour" proposal to the old Committee of Veritas' peers). Frankly I am rather alarmed that Deralia is increasing it's number of Capital ships quite so massively. Does this not concern anyone else? Instead of learning it's lesson, Deralia is militarizing, building more ships, more weapons.. Which world does it have designs on next?
While Deralia did act to protect the people of the Empire and their legitimate government at Caluula it did so against a power which was doing no more or less than Deralia attempted at Dantooine. Why was it okay for Deralia to attack Dantooine but not okay for the Cronese Mandate to attack Caluula? Food for thought I feel.
Thus I will not be in favour of this action until such a time as Deralia apologises fully for it's misdeeds and agrees an indemnity to be paid to the families of the slain on Dantooine - slain in reckless abandon by trained Deralian special forces. Until Deralia has paid fully for it's crime it must be kept in a state of chastisement.
May I further add that Deralia thinks even further military expansion of it's already cavernous fleet is to be undergone. Deralia now has the ability to conquer almost any other Outer Rim world - and has shown great willingness to use it's military. Frankly, if there were not defensive alliances, many worlds would have much to fear from bellicose Deralia. I believe Deralia is a bad example for the Rim, and to remove this provision would be seen as an endorsement of Militarization of small Rim worlds (if for no other reason than they need to be ready to defend themselves against the likes of Deralia).
Next week the Defense Committee will hear a motion to discuss tonnage limits upon Deralia to prevent further expansion and it's according implicit threat to it's neighbours. I would also like to add that I still am open to Deralia changing it's attitude, but this must be accompanied by signs of good faith, not militarization..
For these manifold reasons, I vote against at this time.
Bernard Oriel
Senator for the Planet of Vjun
1st Earl Malreaux (Second Creation)
Vjun Delegation to the Imperial Senate
Message edited by Bernard_Oriel - Tuesday, 14 Feb 2012, 5:56 AM |
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| Avadrie_volFyr | Date: Tuesday, 14 Feb 2012, 9:02 AM | Message # 3 |
 Major general
Group: Users
Messages: 338
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| Empress Teta concurs with the opinion of Senator Oriel and votes against this resolution.
Lady Avadrie volFyr
Senator of Empress Teta
Defense Committee Member
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| Eli_Fitzgerald | Date: Tuesday, 14 Feb 2012, 10:14 PM | Message # 4 |
 Major general
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| I'm not sure who qualify as Deralia's "friends" on this particular issue, but personally I'm more inclined to support this more limited repeal than I was to support the full repeal that Deralia proposed already. This proposal deals with a specific provision, leaving the rest of the Senate's punishments of Deralia intact. Senator Oriel's hyperbole aside, he has convinced me to soften my position somewhat; that is, Deralia probably does deserve the close scrutiny of the Defense Committee, but not forever. Let's not be ridiculous. The Chastisement Act is phrased as a temporary measure, its provisions limited to specific durations (3 years in one provision, 6 months in another, etc). Except when it comes to requiring the approval of the Defense Committee for any and all new ships, ad infinitum. This part of the bill is simply stated matter-of-factly and lasts forever, beyond the lifetime of King Deralius or any of those responsible for the Dantooine incident or indeed any of us.
This is a dramatic over-reach, and I say this as someone who openly supported the killing of Deralians during the Dantooine incident. But Senators, and Senator Oriel in particular, the Deralians responsible for the Dantooine incident are in Imperial custody now. Deralia has confessed it was wrong of them to do. How many more lashes are we going to give to this dead horse?
Deralia can and should do more, I will admit. I agree with Senator Oriel that Deralia needs to finally admit that it used special forces on Dantooine, and that those special forces are responsible for the deaths of many, including non-combatants. Deralia has paid reparations to Dantooine's government (indirectly), but I agree it should also pay restitution to the families of the dead on Dantooine if we're to believe that it genuinely regrets what it did. But to abridge its right to self defense forever? It's excessive, it's an over-reach, as I said, and it should be repealed (or amended to be of limited duration; there also needs to be some consideration of whether this is in violation of the Self Defense Act).
This is in addition to my previous objections to this part of the Chastisement Act.
I'll support a repeal of this provision or an amendment to make it temporary. Because we're working here with a repeal of the provision, that's what I'll vote in favor of. I'll admit that I vote based more often on moral intuition than on reason, but in this case I must urge the latter on my colleagues.
Eli Fitzgerald
Senator of Ralltiir (10 BBY—Present)
"I was elected to do some flamethrowing in the Senate. To a light a fire under those Senators and make it hot for them."
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| Senator_Ordan | Date: Wednesday, 15 Feb 2012, 8:34 AM | Message # 5 |
 Lieutenant general
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| The Axum System is profoundly disinterested in this whole issue. While we broadly are in favour of this motion on principle.. The expanding Deralian tonnage is significant. Would Deralia accept a tonnage limit at a level to be decided by the Defense Committee and Deralia - or a downgrade in mobility? I feel we can and should reach compromise on this.. But there must be give and take by both sides..
Senator Hubert Ordan
__________________________
Senator of the Azure Sector
Foreign Minister of Anaxes
Captain-General of the Azure Interest Protection Squadron
Deputy Chairman of the Ethics Committee
Worshipful Master of the Most Loyal and Honourable Company of Blockadeers
Archtreasurer of the Vault of Pols Anaxes
Autocrat of Selgon
Owner of Azure Durasteel
Systems Admiral (Ret)
Order of the Canted Circle
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| Exar_Ray | Date: Friday, 17 Feb 2012, 8:19 AM | Message # 6 |
 Major general
Group: Users
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| Dantooine is against this. The fact that Deralia is building more weapons, more ships is very much disturbing. I am taking these facts as a slap in the face. With Deralia left without check in this field will prove to be quite dangerous, as they have made their intentions clear that they seek to form an 'empire' of their own. This is an appropriate sanction on them. And if Deralia continues to deny the fact that they used Special Forces upon their planet, then our remaining two prisoners captured during their attempted destruction on Dantooine will NOT be returned and will be tried.
Message edited by Exar_Ray - Friday, 17 Feb 2012, 8:21 AM |
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| LomenRyuun | Date: Friday, 17 Feb 2012, 8:34 AM | Message # 7 |
 Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 696
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| I feel the Defense Committee has a vested interest in Deralia's ship acquisition at this time due to the behavior it has exhibited in recent weeks. I am full in favor of adding a timeline to Deralia's restrictions; simply leaving the measure in place permanently is uncalled for, but at this time, I vote against this measure.
Lomen Ryuun
Senator, Doldur Sector
Senator, Druckenwell
Representative, Monor II (10 BBY - 9 BBY)
Representative, Geridard
Representative, Boranall
Representative, Therenor Prime
Vice-chairman, Defense Committee (Temporarily suspended)
Controlling Shareholder - Druckenwell Arms Corporation
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| Senator_Cambrist | Date: Friday, 17 Feb 2012, 7:09 PM | Message # 8 |
 Lieutenant general
Group: Users
Messages: 761
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| I too am astounded that this continues to be a subject of debate. I was sympathetic to Deralia on this issue at one point, and I suppose I still am. But my passion for this subject has been expended in the face of the continued (and near-unanimous) opposition of the Senate. I do think that Deralia is making a more refined argument here than it was before, and that it's probably worthy of fresh and fair consideration. But to be candid, I'm not here to represent Deralia and I'm hesitant to spend what political capital I have on a cause that is not my own, especially when this cause seems doomed to defeat.
I do agree with Senator Ordan, however, that some sort of compromise on this issue is desirable, if for no other reason than that we'd no longer have to hear about it. Whatever the form of compromise, I urge Senator Oriel to be generous and also mindful of how inconsequential Deralia and particularly Dantooine are compared to the other priorities of the Defense Committee. Even Senator Ray has called this debate "tiresome and boring" and he's said, and I quote, "we have more important matters to attend to." I agree.
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| Sate_Pestage | Date: Tuesday, 21 Feb 2012, 4:33 PM | Message # 9 |
 Lieutenant general
Group: Moderators
Messages: 639
Status: Offline
| There are few votes in on this measure as of yet, but I agree with those Senators who have observed that it is, in all likelihood, a foregone conclusion. Thus, the vote is closed and the measure is defeated with 40% in favor and 60% opposed. Senator Aurelia may protest this if she wants, but I suspect she also sees the mathematical writing on the wall, so to speak.
Sate Pestage
Grand Vizier of the Empire
Assistant to Emperor Palpatine
Chair of the Imperial Senate
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